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Studbook statistics 01/25/2006 03:03 PM
1. Leonid01/26/2006 05:30:24
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
I try to answer to you Jessica.
1. About quantity.
I am not agree with menegment of Studbook in details, but I support rules of this book. Horse, wich is not registrated in the Book is not pure and can not be use in the breeding. Responsibility for registration must have breeder or owner of the horse. And for me is not importance where this horse was born in Germany in Turkmenia or in Russia. Like breeder, I can have trustment to any book, may be American, French or Chinees, if they have letter of General Studbook, wich located in Russia by right of history and legacy.
If we want to change something, we must do it inside of this rights.
Like breeder I have not one gramm of trustment to horses with turkmenian papers. Pedigrees of them are full brothel. For example Wepadar (present of president Niyazov to President Putin) before arrival to Russia changed many names and came to Putin with falsehood paper. By paper, his mother is Duzgunli, but realy Elan (2736). And many many such examples. Beside of a lot of crossing horses.
2. About quality.
Ofcourse graduation of one person can be some subjective, and we must change this situation. But concrete qualification of mrs. Ryabova is highist. I am not agree with this sistem but I am agree with this appraisal in general. Average level of turkmenian horses too much lower then in Russia. It is not becouse I am, like and Ryabova, russian cittizen. It is my real oppinion. More of this, I count, that Ryabova is too much loyalty for turkmenian horses. Certanly, that Gheldy collection was very good, including fact, that most of them he bought from Kazakhstan and Russia.
3. Most of turkmenian breeders don't trust to turkmenian registration and want come back to General Studbook. Most of them are understanding that they are loosing breed, but they live in a fear.
2. Leonid01/26/2006 09:28:28
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
4. Russian breeding after Shamborant is that draw-well where other breeders drew, draw and will draw breeding material. We (everybody) need in improoving of menegment of the Book, but not in destruction of this may be bed sistem.
3. Jessica 01/30/2006 10:04:47
Leonid. Our breed management is in need of modernisation, democracy and sunshine. With sunshine I mean transparency. It is tiresome to struggle with language barriers and bad to non-existing services from the studbook to breeders/owners/association outside Russia.
The confusing situation with the role of MAAK vs VNIIK must be sorted out and the most important question must be answered Who really owns the studbook? The owners have the rights to perform audits of the work and suggest improvement of the work.
No person is bigger than this breed. This has been proven over and over. There are no experts that cannot be replaced.
I have always been lobbying for a mother stud book where every horse will have to be inscribed, that I think is one of the important issues for this breed to survive. But then we all have to work hard to make it possible for every Teke that should belong to the stud book to be inscribed. This is NOT happening today.
The Turkmens are under a tyrannic regime and live in constant fear yes, but they also feel pride of a horse breed they as well as international literature recognise as an original Turkmen breed. They feel deprived of their cultural heritage and a diplomatic solution could have been worked out to solve this Russian - Turkmen dispute over the registrations a long time ago.
The Turkmen registration papers are as unvalid as registration papers issued by other bodies than the VNIIK(puppetPresident Kalashnikov General manager Ryabova) or Russian State (puppetPresident Putin General manager Ryabova) or MAAK (puppetPresident Niazov? General manager Ryabova).
There are many organisations in the world that register Akhal-Tekes today. They do it quick and easy and for many it might be enough to register the horse in your home country with a professional organisation that works with transparency, democracy and efficiency.
Jessica Eile Keith for the Akhal-Tekes!
4. Jessica 01/30/2006 10:42:12
Vladimir Schamborant Geldy Kiarizov and Alexander Klimuk are breeders for conservation and improvement of the Akhal-Teke type. I will only mention a few classical Akhal-Tekes that have been bred by this trio; Yulduz, Dagestan, Sere, Yanardag, Piada, Orlan and Murgab.
Their work is crucial to the breed today when the numbers of sport horse breeders are growing. There must be a balance between the both as otherwise the typical Teke traits will vanish in the quest for the new Absent, the rarest line or the tallest Teke. Unfortunately we see far to few of these classical breeder's horses being used in the west.
5. Leonid01/30/2006 11:38:14
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
I am agree with you Jessica by 100%. 18 - 19 febrary must be conference of russian breeders, may be not russian only, I don't know. Before discussion, I want to know answers for two questions:
1. What rights I have like breeder?
2. If I have some rights, what is the weight of my voice?
If we wont get this positive answers we must take situation in our hands. But all together and without reverence for turcmenian cultural heritage. I have not exclusive senses to dignity of them. All actions of puppetPresident Niazov, Turcmenatlary, breeders wich cross breed are disrespect of me like breeder, like person.
In any case we must think about our customers and suggest them intelligible sistem of identification of teke horses.
6. Leonid01/30/2006 12:51:54
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
Sere was not product of Shamborant, He created such bright Sire like Gundogar, Yasman, Derbent, Adat.
Grigory Chemidov created Dialog, Ashug, Sayvan.
7. Nathalie01/31/2006 05:39:47
Jessica . I totally agree with you concerning problem of horse sport breeder who are looking for performance in order to answer to western buyer. These breeders don't know really what is the akhal teke type and we see more and more akhal teke with less and less type. But the problem is that people (in Europe) don't regognize type because they have never seen a good akhal teke or because their reference is the classical sport horse.
I have 2 mares : one has no type but very good sport exterior and all people are found of her, the other mare has beautiful type and people find her strange. This is a fact that in Europe (in France because I'm french) the good horse looks like a saddle french horse or an anglo arabian and if you want to sell your horse it is better to have a tall akhal teke with sport conformation.
Last year in Villeneuve akhal teke meeting, Tatyana Riabova was there, with a person of Haras Nationaux in charge of akhal teke breeding.
I heard her comments on horses and it was a little bit frightening : she is used to do notation to french saddle horse and she has no reference concerning akhal teke type. She liked only horses with classical sport exterior and no type. Breeders as well don't do any selection work to improve the breed. So this is a big problem...
And just to speak about the refusal of french breeder that Riabova do notation of their horse : owners think that they have the most beautiful akhal teke of the world so when a person says that the horses has no type or bad conformation, they are persuaded that she's wrong ... Maybe I exagerate a little but I'm not so far of true
8. Leonid01/31/2006 12:26:57
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
What problem, Nathalie? Orgcommettee of French meeting invited Mrs Ryabova to look French horses. It was not championship. She was diplomat and finded kind words for everybody. If you need another opinione let invite diferent persons.
9. Jessica 01/31/2006 15:12:26
Yes, yes Sere was born and bred in Turkmenistan, I always make the same mistake, it must be the fantastic picture of Sere and Schamborant that makes my mind think he was the breeder all the time.
10. Leonid02/01/2006 04:36:38
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
During last 15 years such super Sires: Gaysan, Omar, Polot, Melesur, Gayaz, Alaman, Orlan, Ashug, Gaygysyz, Jeykhun, Dialog, Dorkush, Karar, Murgab, Piyada, Amelit, Gasyr Shael, Shaar Shael. And first of them Yasman (Garem-Yalma).
11. Severine02/02/2006 19:05:57
Leonid, I can assure you the comments of Tatiana Riabova wasn't diplomatic at all during the show, in restrictive area for the judges (maybe after, with the breeders...).
And they was no other way for the association to invite Tatiana Riabova, politically. The breed has been recognized the year before in France, and it was the first even for akhal teke horses here. This year, the guest will be different.
I agree with Nathalie about the problem of selection in France, which is missing in most of breed farms, or when exists, is focused on exterior, but not on type. The direction should be shown by an organism with competence (the MAAK ?) and reinforced by championships and prizes (with the condition of not always the same horses each year). There should be a program to train the breeders about the AT breed, so they do not make nonsense. Maybe all the colts shoudn't reproduce (paying attention with the legs stands, type and conformation, because sometimes...). I think that there will be an natural selection of the stallions, based on the demand (or not) of clients for covering. But it will take time during which the damage will be done.
Fortunately some breeders try to make their best to respect the breed (looking what has been done in Russia, but not only), and I hope their work will be recognized. They should be encouraged, hoping the others will realize they twist the breed...
12. Leonid02/03/2006 01:41:09
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
All that I can say you, you must visit general Studs of akhalteke breeding, to make long conversations with famous breeders and look look a hundreds horses. Always truth is on the middle.
13. Severine02/03/2006 05:06:40
I agree, and I hope I will have the chance to visit farms in Russia, Dagestan, ... because I want to know more and to understand some points, but I am not a breeder.
The question is : how to involve the breeders (except some who already try) to breed quality, which is a more difficult work than what they do now ? Till they sell their horses, how convince them...
To show you the difficulty, just think that on july, when Tatiana came, no one wanted (and a very strong opposition) that she evaluates their horses, because when she did it last time, she gave notations under the one she gave them when the horses were in Russia.
Most of people here don't trust her no more .... and most of them didn't care about the recommandations about breeding she gave after the show ...
14. Leonid02/04/2006 04:11:17
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
It is question, why we need to convinince them? Clever breeders come to truth, if they have eyes and desire. Our understanding and our customers, wich vote with money for us, can determ our way of breeding. It is great that breeders have different fancy to development of breed.
I am sure for qualification of Tatiana, trouble, that she has monopoly for this. In any case, I don't understand why you need in this evaluates? Evalutes are the method of mediation between breeder and customer. I count this fact is impossible for Tatiana, like our officer. No one of our horsebreeding has not evalutes of Tatiana, beside of horses, wich were on the rings.
15. Jessica 02/14/2006 17:26:21
Leonid. I hope that you will be able to bring some clarity to the confused VNIIK-MAAK situation and also some nice news for a better future for the organisation of the Teke breed. Changes are being made for the better but things are happening to slow!
We all ask for modernisation and communication from the Russian breed management, breeders outside Russia, including me, are frustrated over how things do not work.
16. Christoph Vogel02/18/2006 15:05:52
Homepage: http://www.achal-tekkiner.ch
The national monopolization of breeding data and the endless, senseless discussion about the "ownership" of the breed of Akhal-Teke is poison for the worldwide development of the Akhal-Teke breed in a global world. The long-term damage to the breed, caused by inefficient, intransparent, possibly also inaccurate horse registration is growing daily.
An incredible short-sighted personal and national egoism is going to destroy the breed. The speculation, that the breed of one of the power player will win the sad game is a big and tragic error.
The main responsible, the most influential, the most knowledgeable, in charge of the breed, are in fact on the best way to destroy the world heritage of the so-called “heavenly horses”.
There are enough models how to manage and administrate successfully a horse breed on an international basis. The “historical” conflict between Russia and Turkmenistan cannot be resolved on a bilateral level. The fact that Russians transferred historical breeding documents from Ashgabat to Ryasan can’t establish any property rights. The solution for the breed has to be found through a “neutral” international institution.
There must be a reason, why WHO, the world wide administration and management of the Arabians is located in London! Interesting enough – the solution is working successfully.
To day, the breed of Akhal-Teke is not in danger by number of horses but by lack of good and efficient breed management and administration on a world wide basis. The longer we wait in order to find an international accepted solution for the breed administration the bigger the danger that the breed will fall apart. This would not be the first breed falling apart but the oldest!
Christoph Vogel
President Akhal-Teke Association of Switzerland
ch.vogel@bluewin.ch
17. Leonid02/20/2006 05:40:47
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
Some questions to Mr. Vogel.
1. I understand that national monopolization means Russian monopolization? I am not agree with you. Why we can not create different national Books wich will work with trustment agreements an with international control for activities of them. We have very bed MAAK, but let go to improve this organization.
2. I have not national egoism, I have breeders egoism, and I want to have voices, corresponding to my weight in this breed. Like breeder I have not this voices, and realy even one voice. It is coincidence that Mrs. Ryabova is Russian like me.
3. At the same time it is truth, that Mrs. Ryabova has more knowledge than you for example. Necesary to see some more than one and a half horses.
4. I have not “historical” conflict between Russia and Turkmenistan. I have conflict, like man, ageinst dictatura. Perhaps you like this sistem. Why do you think, that Russia must present mathirials wich were collected by Russian scientists. It is Russia recieved teke horses when Turkmenians killed them at meat-pocket plants. And Russian breeders saved horses at the beggining of "Perestroyka" when we drank tea without sugar.
5. I suggest you Mr. Vogel to do something for our knowledge about you.
18. Alexandr02/20/2006 09:19:37
Dear Jessica and Todd,
Two days ago I found your web site that made favorable impression on me. Thanks translation, which was made by my daughter Katrina, I got acquainted with some topics and about one I want to express an opinion. The conduct of Stud Book arranges me on the whole. Access to it open for everybody, but, and unfortunately, the most of Turkmen horses not inscribed into Stud book. Turkmenistan wants to issue own stud book. I don’t know come out it or not, but there are more reason (or facts) to doubt in it, because pedigree registration leaves much to be desired. I’d like to say that this real tragedy for breed, and I don’t really know how to find a way out of this situation. Negotiation about possibly collaboration (Turkmen and Russians) T. Rjabova(one must give her credit for) conducted persistency enough, long, but so far unsuccessfully.
Nevertheless many Turkmen breeders register their horses in General Stud book.
Speaking of higher percentage of elite graded Russians Akhal tekes as compared with Turkmen tekes, I can explain that there are many farms in Turkmenistan, which is working only for races, and they don’t take into consideration type (I mean they don’t care about type). So their grades reduced average statistics in Turkmenistan.
I think that main goal of breeding for majority Russians breeders is original type of breed. But I have seen nothing bad, if somebody breeds type-sport horses level Absent. But there are not such breeders in Russia practically. And in Europe as well in Russia, there are breeders, who breed bad and not typical horses. And I didn’t hear that such breeders achieved any success in sport.
By the way, name Absent is in many pedigrees of modern grate horses.
I don’t like how working MAAK at all.
Best regards,
A.Klimuk.
19. Todd Keith02/20/2006 13:08:57
Homepage: http://www.beknazar.com/
Hi,
Welcome Sasha! Nice to see your comments here.
Leonid & Sasha,
Please let us know what happened at the Russian Breeder Conference last weekend.
Curiously,
Todd
20. Leonid02/20/2006 14:13:12
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
This Conference will be 24th of February, friday.
21. Jessica 02/20/2006 17:04:35
We cannot split the stud book for the Tekes. They must all go into one and the same stud book as they always have. As breeders we must accept this fact. Like the WAHO was set up outside the Arabian peninsula to maintain the Arabian breed, the Akhal-Teke stud book was set up outside Central Asia.
The WAHO is not without problems as it works with a lot of different people and countries. We can look at their success but we must also study their weaknesses.
As it looks today with Tekes I think we should be grateful that the breed has one centralised stud book that at least has some integrity. Worst case scenario would be to let the national associations (as they look today) to manage national stud books.
The Teke breed outside Russia is in the hands of pirates and amateurs (I consider myself belonging to the amateurs). None of those groups should run a stud book and in many cases even a registry. I could easily create a Teke-soap on a country by country basis for what would happen if they set up a non-regulated stud book/registry for the heavenly breed. And with confidence I will say that I have quite a good insight in the way most non-Russian/Turkmen associations work and the hidden agendas of the people involved.
That said, does not mean that I will ever stop suggesting, ideas for improvement of todays breed management. I will not stop complaining until the VNIIK employs an international liason that is competent, uncorrupt and organised. And allow for annual audits.
22. Jessica 02/20/2006 19:20:02
Alexander Stephanovich Klimuk. Welcome to my blog. We are looking forward to you sharing your wisdome and experience with us! I guess you are having a lot of beautiful Teke foals this year.
23. Christoph02/21/2006 06:20:47
Homepage: http://www.achal-tekkiner.ch
An attempt to answer Leonid and Jessica
My contribution, dated 18.02.06, was, may be, provocative - sorry about, it wasn’t my intention to insult any body – sorry if that happened – please accept my excuse.
For some years, since 1999, the Swiss AT Association is trying to get an agreement with MAAK in order to coordinate our AT registration in Switzerland with that of MAAK. What we would like to achieve is the right to collect the needed data for AT, born in Switzerland, on behalf and following the roles of MAAK (DNA tests, description of the foal, etc), sending the collected data to MAAK for final approval and entry in the “mother-stud-book” of MAAK. We would be happy, if experts of MAAK would periodically come to Switzerland in order to check our record keeping and to judge the results of our breeding efforts. This would ease the administrative work for us as well as for MAAK. Up to now, at my knowledge, such an agreement was only made between France and MAAK (unfortunately I do not know the details of this agreement). For Switzerland it was, until now, impossible to get such an understanding.
In the last months I made a new effort to get in to contact with MAAK by e-mails I got a friendly answer from Ganna Zernova, telling me that my e-mails arrived within MAAK and that she hopes that MAAK will answer. Until now, I got no answer from MAAK. Even the transfer of payments for annual MAAK membership is a problem: I do not get a bank-account-number where I have to pay the Money. Money sent by Western Union is getting lost somewhere in the system.
That was my personal starting point, writing my comment, dated 18.02.06
To the comments of Leonid:
1 National monopolization or “ownership” is not only made by Russia but also by Turkmenistan – that is, frankly speaking, a problem for the breed. This is no accuse, no blame - take it as fact!
As explained above, national registration with approval of MAAK is what we would like, up to now, at least for Switzerland, it was not possible.
2 Also small countries with small AT-associations and small breeders can have problems to be solved, independently of “weight” – there are other aspects than “survival of the fittest”.
3 No comment – that is your judgment of my person.
4 No comment – lets try to find solutions for the future.
5 Difficult to understand what I should do?
An attempt to answer Jessica
1) One stud book – was that not what I was asking for – including, if ever possible, all AT and all countries!
2) WHO - I agree that it is difficult and not without problems but we have to solve the same problem: a lot of people and a lot of countries: big ones bur also small ones.
3) I always regarded the Swiss AT registration as a temporary solution until an agreement with MAAK is found. What should we do else in the mean time? We try to register as correctly, as carefully as possible, following the roles of MAAK – we would be happy if MAAK would come tomorrow to check it’s correctness!
4) May I ask you directly: do you think that the Swiss AT registration is corrupt and incorrect? If yes, I would be happy to get your detailed information about in order to improve our registration!
What do you mean by hidden agendas? Could you explain that?
Best regards
Christoph
24. Jessica 02/21/2006 10:37:55
Christoph, you are allowed to be provocative on this blog. Personally I decide to not get insulted by others.
Your frustration with the arrogance you meet from the stud book management is understandable and of course unacceptable for any of us. Every breeder or representative for an association that work for the Teke breed must be met with professionalism and respect. It is a shame for our breed that arrogance and dictatorship rule today. This is really bad business for breeders as well as bad marketing for the breed.
So we can agree on one mother stud book for the breed that is imperative for our breed. The foundation of the mother stud book is based on thorough work and open sources and I cannot see that anyone could have done a better job than the Russian Scientists and Turkmen breeders that lay the foundation for the written pedigrees and formation of a stud book.
I have a copy of the stud book published by the Swiss At Assn. in 2000. It is not called a registry it is called a stud book eventhough it looks more like a registry. However, horses can be inscribed in your stud book without verification from the mother stud book, you allow for AI and you also have stallion approval processes. This, I mean, is quite a big step away from the rules of the General stud book. As I have told you before, this stud book has been shown to us when we visited VNIIK headquarters as an example of a worthless work by amateurs. It is obvious from your comment above though, that it seems like you haven't been contacted about it, that is too bad as you are the ones that have been asking for comments/approval of your work.
The former president of your association also had plans to create a new stud book for at least all countries in Europe excluding Russia by merging in step one with Germany as they have a large number of Tekes. I know nothing of how these plans develop.
Obviously you have other plans for the Swiss association than the former president had. Your plans seem to be more in line with following the mother stud book registration process.
However, as you are outside the EU you can act as you want to. Within EU the respect and cooperation with every breed's mother stud book is encouraged. As you know countries as protective and proud of breeds they consider national.
You ask me if I think that the Swiss AT Assn. is corrupt and incorrect. My answer is that there are different people in your association and many of them do a great job for the breed and are involved in the associaion for the best of the breed. But you have also had people in higher positions that have behaved in a way that have been destructive for the global and European cooperation among the association. And yes, if you think that everyone join an association for the good of the cause, you are very wrong.
25. Leonid02/21/2006 13:09:06
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
Jessica, I can not say better. In any case, it is very difficult to destroy this bed management, but we must suggest something instead of. Studbook is enterprise with office, budget, personal and general - data bank, wich is property of VNIIK. All, as I imagine the reconstruction of this situation to do agreement between MAAK, like union of breeders, and VNIIK about "To take control of Studbook" with data bank. But I think it is possible to decide this question with chief of VNIIK. And your role is not small. In this case tatyana must decide: "Who is she?" With us or not.
26. Alexandr02/21/2006 14:19:49
Hi! Jessica. We already have 12 akhal teke foals. 
27. Alexandr02/21/2006 14:26:29
Mr. Vogel. You was right in some questions. (I mean in your second comments).
28. Jessica 02/22/2006 14:28:05
Alexander, Leonid
Todd and I will have no foals this year, for a breeder it is a very sad situation. I would be very happy if you could email me pictures of your foals and I can publish them on my blog, so at least I can look at some pictures of Teke foals born this year. And as I know that among your foals we will see some of the future champions of the breed I think many others will want to see them to.
29. Jessica02/22/2006 15:13:56
Leonid, Alexander
You will meet with the stud book management on Friday. I would like to suggest that they read some of the messages from this blog to understand that there are many serious Teke breeders and lovers who work hard for the breed in the world that feel very frustrated over having to deal with the arrogance and incompentence from the VNIIK officials.
VNIIK must realise, we live in the Teke year of 2006, that their work with breeds that has a great international interest is audited by a group of people that are used to efficiency and open, non-discriminating, documented methods for their work.
It is embarrassing to see how the management for our breed spends Teke means and efforts on promoting themselves and people they think the have something to gain from.
I would like to see genuine efforts to create a modern, professional organisation for the breed that will widen our market and in the long run lead to improvements of the breed.
I know that also the Russian breeders that are not in favour are having a hard time now, no one gains from the present situation. No one person is bigger than this breed. We are now in the situation very close to split of stud book. Historically we know that private or non-breed-governed stud books will inscribe part bred Tekes and that will lead to the fact that parts of the pure bred population will be closed out from the genepool.
Examples on the above:
Turkmenistan today. We do not know how the pure breds are registered with their stud book. Partbreds might be inscribed as pure breds.
USA in the 80's one breeder started a private registry where part breds where inscribed as pure breds. This still causes problems here.
Germany 80's until now- no control of purity of Tekes that are inscribed into the different verbands, part breds are inscribed as pure breds.
Switzerland 90's has created a stud book with horses inscribed that are not checked with VNIIK.
Would we see more serious splits in the future, one person, will be remembered in history as the one who caused many of these splits and problems. The epitet this person will be remembered with, is not the mother of the breed, in that case.
HoweverI think we have the following pluses with todays system
A mother stud book with a well documented foundation work by scientists.
The mother stud book is owned/managed by a country that is willing to pay part of the costs for adminstation.
The stud book has for a longer period been managed by a group of dedicated scientists.
The management for the stud book has relevant education.
The Moscow Show, (as long as the winner is not called World Champion) is an establishment that is a nice Teke event for everyone to enjoy.
The Pyatigorsk show and races for the southern Tekes is very important.
30. Leonid02/23/2006 00:03:19
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
O'key
31. Leonid02/25/2006 03:03:20
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
Dear Jessica and Todd, uor conference is finished. The next result.
Studbook mamagement (SBM) is not ageinst of any reconsrtructions of MAAK, AATK and any another outfit. They agree to choice judges and other positions too. We can play in our sand-box in any games. So Initiative group will create suggestions by new statutes of MAAK and AATK and prepare new conference of breeders not only russian. It is positive.
At the same time, we can not have effect on Studbook management, on appraisal, on the rules of meetings absolutly.
Ofcourse I am not going to be member of AATK, becourse I don't look base of this union without rights. I will be member of MAAK directly and we must try to change situation from international base.
"Nightingales can sing, but cat eat meat"
32. Leonid02/25/2006 03:56:00
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
By declaration of Studbook managment akhalteke horses will breed by partbreed traditions with using of any biotechnologies. Oppinions of breeders are zero.
33. Todd Keith02/25/2006 09:03:07
Homepage: http://www.beknazar.com/
Does this mean ALL technologies? Semen, embrio transfer even cloning???
If so, send me Adat semen, Orlan DNA and maybe you know where Yulduz is burried, you can dig him up and get his DNA???
Todd 
34. Jessica 02/25/2006 09:49:31
Alexander and Leonid. You did a great job in the meeting, a big and warm pat on the shoulder from the biggest Teke owner in the state of Florida and the biggest Teke owner in the state of California who is visiting us this weekend.
Nightingales and cats, I vision a train of breeders that will not stop for anything. Let's get on the train and get going!
35. Jessica 02/25/2006 09:52:22
Leonid. Regarding reproductional technologies, we need an ethical commtittee than can work out guidelines for how to use these technologies in the Teke breed. This is a very important question for all of us. The embryo transfer and cloning must be restricted by well defined rules that protects the breed and the breeders.
36. Leonid02/25/2006 10:34:33
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
Todd, all means all. Come to Russia and we try to find part of mortal remains of Yulduz, Sere, cut out piece of meet of Orlan, or another horse. All what you want, prego signori.
Thank you Jessica for kind words. Our locomotive is working yet. Jessica, really, I can't imagine biotechnologies in the Teke breed. It means finish of development of breed and finish of business. Finish of creation. In this case word "thoroughbred" means nothing.
37. Leonid02/27/2006 06:03:58
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
I suddest to create top group in Akhal-Teke breed "Asyl-Teke", where will conclude akhalteke horses, which bred by natural method. This group must has papers of General StudBook. At the present time more easier to consist "black list" of horses were breeding by biotechnologies. Pedigree of horses of this group must be clear from "black" horses.
38. Lisa Belhage02/27/2006 07:36:48
So you think that Pirakhmed and Tohtamish, for example, should be black-listed?
-Lisa
39. Leonid03/01/2006 05:41:42
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
Pirakhmed and Tokhtamysh were bred before of our ban.
40. Allegra Steck03/03/2006 11:01:34
Oh, I see. So biotechnology is not wrong as long as you have exceptional frozen semen to breed World Champions, but after that is gone then suddenly biotechnology is evil ?
41. Leonid03/03/2006 12:08:40
Homepage: http://www.shael-teke.ru
We get World Champions without biotechnology too. But after this experiment bethinked and decided to ban this evil doodahs.
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